The following are the outputs of the captioning taken during an IGF intervention. Although it is largely accurate, in some cases it may be incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors. It is posted as an aid, but should not be treated as an authoritative record.
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>> CHENGETAI MASANGO: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. We are about to start our next session. The Leadership Panel presenting the Internet P1 paper if you could please take your seats.
Thank you very much and thank you for your patience. I know that we are the ones that are between you and the dinner, but I assure you this will be a great session. Just as a form of introduction, the Leadership Panel was established by the United Nations Secretary‑General last August, and it is supposed to be a strategic empowered and multi‑stakeholder body to support and strengthen the IGF.
It has three key functions, and one is to provide strategic inputs and advice on the IGF. The second is to protect the IGF and its outputs.
Supporting both high level and at large multi‑stakeholder engagement in the IGF and also IGF fundraising efforts, and the last priority is to exchange ideas of output from the forum to other fora and vice versa and bringing it back into the IGF. And also leveraging the right MAG expertise. So they are working in concert with the Multi‑stakeholder Advisory Group of the IGF.
And the panel consists of ten members. It's Chaired by Vint Cerf, and our Vice Chair is Maria Ressa. They will introduce themselves later going down, and there is also five ex officio members, one is the Secretary‑General's Envoy on Technology and the other one is the current MAG Chair, followed by three which is the current host, the previous host of the IGF and the upcoming host of the IGF.
So with that I give the floor to the Chair of the Leadership Panel, Mr. Vint Cerf to take it on from here.
>> VINT CERF: Thank you so much, Chengetai, and good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for your patience as we got ourselves organized. In case you are wondering about the empty Chair, we are hoping that the Tech Envoy will be able to join us when he gets here.
In the meantime what we would like to talk to you about is a paper that the Leadership Panel developed over the past several months. It's called The Internet We Want. And what I would like to emphasize for you is that the term Internet in this context is far broader than simply the thing connecting computers together, which to be quite frank, was what I was focused on 50 years ago when the Internet project was first launched, but 50 years later it is everything is connected to everything including you and me, people, Internet of things, devices and businesses, Governments, all kinds of different parts of our planet or interconnected. Not as completely as we would like, and not as usefully always as we would like, and that's why we want to talk to you about the Internet and at large that we collectively think that we want and will work towards, and we hope that you will join us in this.
The Internet Governance Forum as you well know has been under way for 18 years. And in that time, it has itself evolved along with the Internet, and I might say it must continue to evolve, in order to satisfy the needs of this growing online digital environment. And I am proud to say that I have every confidence that the IGF and its Secretariat and all of you who make up its activities will continue to evolve to meet the needs of this demanding online environment.
I want to acknowledge Paul Mitchell who is in the middle there, Paul, if you will raise your hand, he is the outgoing Chair of the MAG. I would like to invite you to thank him prematurely because he does not escape until the end of the week, but can I ask that we acknowledge all of the hard work.
(Applause).
As Paul will tell you a great deal of what he is able to accomplish is done through the active support of the Secretariat. Finally, I will just mention a few specific things about this paper that I would like to draw to your attention. And then I'm going to ask various of the panel members to make some specific remarks and I will introduce them as we do that.
So with regard to the paper, The Internet We Want, the thing that we would like most clearly is that it stays whole, that is to say, it is connected. I could not over emphasize the importance of connectivity. It was the fundamental purpose of the network was to provide connectivity among computer‑based systems way, way back in 1973 at the time focused on the needs of the American Defense Department looking for the use of computers in command and control.
How far we have come from that initial vision to something far greater, far more powerful, and far more challenging to manage as you will hear in the rest of this session. We wanted to also stay as open as we can possibly make it. Once again, why is that important? Because it's the free flow of information which we heard about this morning in the first session that animates this system, that makes it useful.
Without the flow of information, this is a dead object which doesn't do anything useful. However, as we maintain connectivity, we have discovered, let us say, unanticipated or at least undesirable consequences of this massive connectivity, and we have discovered, frankly, that people are people, and they take advantage of technologies that have this kind of amplification capacity for purposes that perhaps you and I would agree are not in anyone's best interest or at least not in everyone's best interest.
So we want to keep the Internet whole and open, and that is the beginning of the discussion that this paper contemplates. Last point I want to make is that this is not a static paper. The Leadership Panel recognizes that the evolution of the Internet, the evolution of IGF, and this paper must go into the future anticipating further changes and developments as we learn how to solve some of the problems that we encounter today.
So I'm going to turn next to Maria Fernanda who has been on the stage several times she is the Chair board of the ICC and a respected member of the panel and she is speak to the universal and inclusive nature of the Internet we want. I will be calling on a few other board members specifically after which I will be asking them for general marks about their involvement in this desirable properties of the Internet.
>> MARIA‑FERNANDA GARZA: One of the characteristics of the Internet we want is for it to be inclusive for everyone. The Internet today under pins agriculture, energy, healthcare manufacturing and education. It has fundamentally changed the way people interact with their peers, business and Governments. Universal and meaningful connectivity can drive economic development, improve education, healthcare, and access to information while fostering innovation and social inclusion.
However, despite significant progress in expanded Internet access, 2.6 billion people remain unconnected. Some of those people lack a way to get online, or cannot afford to do so requiring further infrastructure and innovative technological policy approaches to expand connectivity.
However, it's not just about providing infrastructure. Some people may not have the skills to use digital technologies in the way they want. Some might not have a reason to go online because there is no content which gives them a compelling reason to engage in digital technologies or which is not in their language.
We need to be cognizant of the way in which these three things, access, skills and applications interact to reinforce digital divides.
Achieving this goal will require collaborative efforts from Governments, business, civil society, and other stakeholders to ensure that the Internet is accessible, affordable, and beneficial to everyone. To command meaningful connectivity, stakeholders must have a better understanding of how information and communication technologies work in practice, including the ICT ecosystem, the roles of stakeholders, and relevant policy issues.
Frameworks for the Internet connectivity should be based on like touch policies and regulations that encourage universal access, competition, innovation, and the development of new technologies.
At first to deliver universal connectivity should balance the needs of all stakeholders, be data driven, promote interoperability and standards, and facilitate investment across the digital value chain. The Internet We Want paper calls on all stakeholders to set goals for achieving universal meaningful connectivity, promoting the adoption of new technologies and addressing skill gaps.
We count on the IGF community to help us in formulating those goals, set the metrics to measure the progress, and think about how they can move this work forward together and faster. Thank you, Vint.
>> VINT CERF: Thank you so much, Maria, as always your words are very thoughtful, and also challenge us to move ahead along the lines that you suggest.
I'd like to call now on our Vice Chair, Maria Ressa to speak to the free flowing and trustworthy nature of the Internet and you heard from her earlier today on some of the difficulties that we encounter that she has personally encountered in this John line environment. So the microphone and the flow is yours.
>> MARIA RESSA: Thanks, Vint. This is one of the five pillars we had put together for The Internet We Want.
I am the novice and I delivered to the collective wisdom of the group in so many ways, but the panel this morning also tackled this that data flows. Data is the core part of the Internet today. It is the life blood of the Internet, but it must be free flowing, and trustworthy.
The cross‑border data flows that really under pin the delivery of these public services that we need, everyday business functions and collaboration for which the processing and transfer of both personal and non‑personal data are integral making trust a vital element for resilient and sustainable economic growth. This earlier, in the earlier panel, I talked about the social harms, the way the data, the manipulation of data can tear us apart, but far more important now is really what is the vision of how we are going to be able to pull this together.
We believe trust is key. It's strengthened when Governments adopt robust and comprehensive commitment to protect the rights and freedoms of individuals, of all of us, including the fundamental right to privacy, cooperation between Governments and all is needed to set interoperable policy frameworks that would facilitate the cross‑border data flows. We call on the stakeholders of the Internet, that is all of us, to set goals to unlock the value of the data flows for sustainable development and enshrine trust as the prerequisite of data sharing regimes founded on the protection of data.
>> VINT CERF: Every time I listen to you, Maria, I think of how important it is that we listen to your experience and also the challenges that you put before us. Trust is incredibly hard to gain and easy to lose. You have heard that more than once, and it's worth reiterating. What I think is most serious is figuring out how to build trust into the system. The part that I find the most troubling is that there is no magic that technology will introduce to make trust happen.
Trust is a concept between people and institutions. We learn trust from experience. It's not a magic bullet that a digital signature assures. Accountability is important, the ability to identify parties is important. How would we do business transactions without that? We learn to trust because we learn to trust sources of information based on experience.
So we have a long ways to go in this online environment to establish the kinds of trust that we learned to establish in the offline environments that we lived in for so many years. While speaking of safety and security, Lise Fuhr, who is the Director General of the European telecommunications network operators and a distinguished member of this panel has something to tell us about safety and security, Lise.
>> LISE FUHR: Thank you.
Cybersecurity and security has been one of the things close to my heart for many years so I'm glad to be talking about this with this esteemed panel and these esteemed colleagues because this is a brain trust of many people with different backgrounds and different approach to Internet and security in general.
But the more embedded, and the more digital our lives become, we need, of course, to make sure that cyber space is safe and secure, and it's not only the Internet as we also started with saying. It's everything digital because it's more than the Internet today. It's Internet of things, but it's also AI and it's the things that are under pinning the systems under pinning our software, anything related to cars, banks, et cetera. We are so strongly depending on digital, we are strongly depending on the Internet so we need to make sure it's well functioning.
The ICANN Chair, Tripti Sinha said it very beautifully earlier today. She said tech is built for people and we need to make sure that it brings value to people. I think being safe and secure is another thing under pinning the value of anything in tech.
So strengthening cybersecurity is a target we think is extremely important in the Leadership Panel, but, of course, we need to make it safe without jeopardizing the openness, and without harming any trust in the Internet. And security is an area where all parts of the Internet Ecosystem need to work together to ensure it. So we need an Internet that would stay safe and secure, but we also need to have a joint effort to make sure that this is happening.
That's why we think it's important that we or even paramount, sorry, that we will set goals to establish and implement robust frameworks for cybersecurity including legal structures, practices and cross‑border cooperation to combat cybercrime.
But, again, this is something that we need to talk about and set goals and measures together, and this is why it's important we are here to reach out to all of you to understand how you see it. Thank you.
>> VINT CERF: Thank you so much, Lise. I want to emphasize something she mentioned. She used the word software. It's really important for everyone in this room to recognize that the Internet is made up of software. It is an extremely diverse ecosystem. And the fact that these are artifacts created by human beings, and I will set aside the fact that some large language models seem to be able to write programmes as well. That's an interesting think to contemplate, our problems with software relate to the fact that we can never do this perfectly.
Moreover, I use the word diverse ecosystem on purpose. The vast array of devices that are part of the Internet represent not a single uniform and unified system. It is an extremely diverse ecosystem of software, and no surprise that it doesn't always work perfectly.
So our safety and security here is an objective, but it's not something that I expect we could guarantee. And let us pretend for a moment that the Internet was in factually purely, absolutely safe and secure, that would still not protect us against some of the problems that Maria points out because people would use the safe and secure Internet to pass misinformation, disinformation, hate speech and all of the other problems we have encountered. So safety and security are necessary, but not sufficient to create the Internet that we want.
Speaking of rights and rights respecting aspects, I would like to call on Gbenga Sesan who is the Executive Director of Paradigm in Nigeria. So the floor is yours.
>> GBENGA SESAN: So 75 years ago in Paris everyone, various countries, various stakeholders agreed on one thing. It's always tough to agree on one thing, but we all agreed on human rights. A lot has changed in those 75 years, but one thing hasn't changed the fact that dignity is still at the centre of human experience and expectation, and as that's why as part of the Internet we want, we strongly believe that human rights must be respected online, and offline.
And in all forms of expressions of online, be it on the Internet, be it on digital devices, or be it on devices that don't exist yet. And, of course, we have learned that The Internet We Want is one where everyone is protected from those harms. A human rights‑based approach to Internet Governance is required to realize the full potentials and full benefits of the Internet. There are many opportunities, there are many problems that we wish to solve using the Internet, and we may not be able to do that if we do not make sure that rights are respected.
And this is including the right to education. As we learned three years ago when people had to go online to go to school, it was impossible for many children across the world to learn. We note today that those children not only lost what they could have learned but they also lost skills that their contemporaries were able to pick up because they were online and were able to moderate their own expectations and learning experiences.
Not just in education, also participation in public and cultural life, the right to gather, the right to discuss, the right to participate is absolutely important, and anything that restricts such participation is something we need to work on so that we can realize the full potential of the Internet. Also access to information. Of course, not just access to information that we want people to hear, but access to information, and we must also ensure the rights of businesses of all sizes.
And I like that we have emphasized that it's businesses of all sizes because there are small businesses that may fight for attention, but their rights must also be protected in the space.
And this is why we say that every stakeholder from Government to civil society to private sector to the technical community to the media, to every other stakeholder must set goals to ensure that the human rights‑based approach is what we take to Internet Governance and to promote digital rights in this online space, and like I said earlier, you know, we had a conversation 75 years ago.
We don't know what 75 years from now will look like, but at least one thing we do know is that human dignity will be at the centre of human expectation and experiences, and we must respect that right now online and offline.
>> VINT CERF: I listen to Gbenga, and you just want to do what he is saying. You are so passionate about this. What I conclude as I listen, though, to what he had to say is that we are not likely to achieve perfection in this aspiration. In the absence of perfection, we must achieve direction. We must mid‑course correct our vector in the Internet's evolution in order to get closer to that very desirable outcome that Gbenga beautifully expressed.
So I would like to call on Julia now to speak to the problems she faces in Ethiopia. She is the State Minister of innovation and technology. Now, there is a wonderful title and a huge burden. So I would like to hear from you about the challenges you see in your country to get the Internet in place so people can use it.
>> BELETE MOLLA: Thank you so much. I would like to thank, Mr. Chairman. What do we want? All The Internet We Want in our country, especially as I'm living in Africa, so what we really need is we need to connect all over the world. This is the priority of our country, how we can make it, how we can connect with the other world is the major thing. So to do this, the first thing is we need to have the infrastructure.
We need to provide the Internet access for all in the country and in the continent. So to do this we need to have a common infrastructure to have, to improve the accessibility of all people connecting the Internet. So while we are having a common infrastructure that we are going to have a common content or because we are living in diverse country, diverse society, so especially if we take Ethiopia, we have more than 18 languages in the country.
So while they are having the infrastructure, they need to use it in their own language too. So we need to work on the content too. They have to use the Internet to content. To do this, we need to work on the digital skills, the development of skills, disability literacy.
So when people have literacy, they can use the technology, they can learn from technology, and they can create technology because they easily understand what does it mean.
So the first thing we are working on building the infrastructure, which is connectivity, and power, and the other infrastructures which are needed has to be working first. Then the enabling systems, digital enabling systems like digital ID, digital payments and cybersecurity.
So they will follow after the infrastructure. So the third one would be the platforms which are very important to interact with the different technology activities, like E‑government, E‑service, and E‑commerce. So our people are working on that, so the ecosystem is the most important thing. We need to centre our people, our work has to be centric on the people. We need to work on this. If they have the skills, the digital skills, it is easy to use the technology for them.
So we are working on the people to have the necessary skills so when they have the skills, they can use the technologies and they can work on those issues. So in Ethiopia what we did we launched digital Ethiopia 2025 strategy, so with four pillars, building the infrastructure and like connectivity we liberalize the telecom sector so we are inviting different telecom sectors to our country.
So this way we are expecting that it will improve the quality service because not having the infrastructure is not enough it has to be quality, the service has to be quality and accessibility is the most important thing, meaningful accessibility. When we are saying meaningful accessibility, it has to be the services it has to be quality in terms of Internet, in terms of using mobile services.
And it has to be reasonable, affordability, the critical thing even though there are some infrastructures, some services, if they are not affordable they cannot use it. So it has to be affordable not only in terms of price, but in terms of the devices they are using. So we need to invest a lot to provide reasonable devices, price of devices in the country and the content also very important.
To do this, people are competing and working on that. So this is how we are working at a country level, especially building the ecosystem is strengthening our financial sectors to support our innovative young people who are creating a lot of new technologies, advanced technologies so we need to support, to coordinate because I always believe that we have a common goal to make a better place, a better world for every humanity.
So this is for all of us, we need to cooperate, we need to collaborate, to make a better world for everyone. So we need to connect those people who are not connected yet. As we know, the number is big. So we have to connect that. To do so, we need to work together. We need to collaborate. Thank you.
>> VINT CERF: So there you have the global picture in one country, all of the problems that we are faced with show up in Ethiopia, it's a Fractal system, everything is recursive. If you solve your problems, you will help us solve the same problems around the rest of the world.
I'd like to call on Karoline Edstadler next who is the federal minister for the European Union and the Constitution in Austria who is never at a loss for words, and who has been introduced to you earlier. So Karoline Edstadler, maybe you can help us see The Internet We Want.
>> KAROLINE EDSTADLER: Thank you so much, Vint, Godfather of the Internet, if I may say so. I wanted to give the picture because you are impressed or not impressed by what we are presenting to you, but I would like to show you it was not so easy when we started our work. We are spread all over the world.
We started our first debates online, okay, this is maybe normal for an Internet Governance Forum Leadership Panel, but on the other hand, if you don't know each other, it's not so easy. You have to get to know each other and we all know how we suffered during the pandemic not getting into touch with each other.
So now we know each other quite well, I would say, we met for the first time as I remember in a physical way in Ethiopia. I invited the group to Vienna, and almost all of the group were there, and Geneva in Switzerland and now here in Tokyo. I think we are many steps forward now in the meantime because we have this paper, The Internet We Want.
We can feed to this paper. We have some pillars as Maria Ressa mentioned. There is also something that is very important from my view, the rights approach. So we have the need to have a human rights approach also for the maybe regulations. We need without stopping innovation.
So this is what we reached also in civil society, there is a lot more awareness and, of course, everyone has AI in his or her hands with ChatGPT and other applications. So this is the work how we try to fulfill our mandate also, which should end in August next year, maybe a bit later because we want to feed into the Digital Global Compact also. And we are, of course, open for your ideas and recommendations also and your experiences because I think AI is learning a lot every day.
So do we, at least we try, even if we are not that quick, and we hope also for your contributions. Thank you so much.
>> VINT CERF: Thank you so much, Karoline, and for that last point for all of you those listening and those on the distribution list for the IGF, we hope that you will take time to read this paper and react to it. We want to express what we believe are your principles and your aspirations. If we have not done so, we need to know that.
So we ask you, please, to respond with your ideas and your comments and criticisms. We have a few other speakers I would like to call upon and we won't quite end at 6:15, but we will try to be crisp about this.
I would like to ask Hiroshi‑San, our host in some sense here in Japan, here in Kyoto, and may I say, it has been a magnificent reception. The organisation is spectacular. The venue is beautiful, and we are taking great advantage and pleasure in meeting here. What is important is what you have learned from your involvement with the panel and your engagement with the Internet in Japan and elsewhere.
What else would you add to what we have already said about The Internet We Want?
>> HIROSHI YOSHIDA: Thank you. Thank you, Vint. First of all, I would like to welcome you all to Kyoto, this wonderful city and it's a very beautiful place and I hope you have time to look around the city.
About The Internet We Want, yes, why do you think Internet has developed for these 50 years, so I think that it is open and tree network system, and the central concept is human‑centred network and also one more question, why IGF, Internet Governance Forum is attracting many people? So it is a multi‑stakeholder approach. So any stakeholders can come together and discuss how we can improve the Internet.
And so that more and more people are taking part in the discussion here, and this year more than 8,000 registrants and 6,000 of them are in person. And 70% or 80% are coming from abroad. And so digital concept is very important. Of course, we have many challenges as referred to by previous speakers. So we still, we still now on the way of building up trust.
So Japan advocated the concept of the free flow of trust in G20 Osaka meeting in 2019, and so that concept is well known, but we think that it should be shifted to operational stage, not conceptual stage.
So we want to accelerate data flow by building up trust. And, of course, other issues regarding cybersecurity and other things, new challenges are coming up, and we should incorporate them. And also new technologies are coming up and so there are many evolutions, and, of course, for example, so network system is changing from fixed network to mobile system, and now there are many non‑terrestrial systems so very typical and we also have newer system that is called High Altitude Platform System. So we should not hesitate to introduce those new technologies.
Of course, there are many challenges to doing so. For example for Generative AI, we have many challenges. We are starting a long discussion, but the technology is going so fast, so we should do it in a very short period, we should challenge corporate in a very short period. It is a hard task but we should do it.
Anyway, so there are many challenges and many new technologies coming up, but what we should keep, something basic concept that should not be changed, at some point that I what I referred to in the first point, which is open and free and human centred and multi‑stakeholder approach. Those concepts should be kept. And that is basic concept we should do our work on the Internet. Thank you very much.
>> VINT CERF: Thank you very much. I would interpret some of your remarks to suggest that the IGF has enormous potential, it has enormous capacity. That's all of you who are here and those who are listening and are participating.
This is a body of some substance, and it is an important one whose work should continue. So we have two other speakers left, and I'm going to ask first of all, Paul Mitchell, who has spent two years as the Chair of the MAG, the Multi‑stakeholder Advisory Group. As you think, Paul, about the challenges that lie ahead of us looking ahead towards the Global Digital Compact and the outcomes of the, you know, future, the plans for the future, speculations for the future, can you say a little bit about the IGF's capacity to evolve because your successor is going to have to adapt the IGF work towards an even larger agenda, I think, than it has already experienced. So perhaps you can opine on that for the benefit of your successor and those who work with you to make the IGF such a useful body.
>> PAUL MITCHELL: I think the most important element here is to remember that this is a platform, a platform that can fulfill multiple different types of objectives at the same time and can be used for good, can be used for not so good, and it all depends on the creativity and the collaboration and the work ethic, and the goals behind it that people are willing to put their own investments in in order to make the results come alive.
And just looking at around here just at the beginning of this IGF, and you see the enthusiasm in some of the presentations today, and you see the enthusiastic number of registrations, over 8,000 people, you just know there is something there that will shine and will really work for the betterment of humanity as long as we keep in focus the platform, collaboration and the fact that you can do anything with a will.
>> VINT CERF: So there you have it. Where there is a will, there is a way. So, Amandeep, you are the closing speaker, and as the extraordinary Secretary‑General's Tech Envoy, you have worked very hard to help us articulate the challenges that this digital online environment poses. Your work on the Global Digital Compact is notable and visible.
As you know, I am persuaded that the IGF, which has functioned well and increasingly well over the last 18 years has the capacity to be helpful in instantiating and evolving that compact, and maybe even suggesting components of it.
We had a chance to meet with the two facilitators of the Global Digital Compact this morning, and I'm pleased to say that we have an opportunity as the Leadership Panel to continue our engagement with those two facilitators. So, Amandeep, perhaps your view about IGF and the role it can play in helping to make the Global Digital Compact a useful and constructive object.
>> AMANDEEP SINGH: Thank you, Vint. It's a great pleasure to join my fellow members of the Leadership Panel to talk about the role of the IGF and the content of the GDC, but to share just a brief thought on the Internet we want. I think the Internet is an extraordinary global resource, and the vision behind it needs to be refreshed at regular intervals.
So what you have today from all of us after multiple engagements across different stakeholders is an attempt at refreshing that vision, and as my fellow panelists have said, this is a vision about an open, free, secure, inclusive and human‑centred digital future.
And this aligns very much with the Secretary‑General's vision for the Global Digital Compact. A once in a generation opportunity to come together and adopt a shared global framework for building our digital future together at the Summit of the Future next year in September.
The IGF, the Internet Governance Forum is a unique multi‑stakeholder forum in the context of this unique global public resource. It has unique features which no other forum has, and the kind of participation that our Japanese hosts can be proud of, the kind of diversity that this forum has, and the depth of expertise that comes together in these rooms every year.
So definitely the IGF will play a central role in the implementation of the Global Digital Compact which has to be multi‑stakeholder as well, so if the path to the GDC is a multi‑stakeholder path, the path beyond the GDC has to be multi‑stakeholder as well.
And in that future path, the IGF will play its due role. It is after all creation of the UN. It is a unique forum, and the only place where we can discuss the public policy aspects of the Internet in this manner, and the Internet is going to continue to play a role in our digital future and, therefore, the IGF will continue to play that role.
You will tomorrow at the Plenary Session hear the Secretary‑General's remarks on this occasion, and he will reiterate his vision. He will reiterate I'm sure his support for the IGF and how it comes into play in terms of our future work.
So thank you very much for the great inputs that came in from the Addis Ababa meetings into the Global Digital Compact process and thank you very much for the inputs being generated this week starting today, day zero, for the next phase of the Global Digital Compact process which is going to be an intense negotiations phase ahead of the Summit of the Future.
>> VINT CERF: Thank you so much, Amandeep. I can imagine some of the members of the panel sitting on the stage now have other things they would like to say, but considering that we are over the originally planned time and I have a meeting I need to go to, I am going to ask you to thank our panel for their contributions, and their work, and to thank you also for all of the contributions you have made up until now, the contributions this week, and those that you will make in the future. Thank you all very much for attending.
(Applause).